- This post by Goldy301 was thumbed up by:
- PurpleYoshi (October 21st, 2015, 10:43 pm)
Question about religion
Forum rules
This is Serious Discussion. If you want to tell us how your day was or just get some things off your chest, you will find ample opportunity to find a corner to discuss all the good things we see, or reach out to anyone who needs help. Just remember to pay attention to the Principles of Serious Discussion, and link to the source if posting news.
This is Serious Discussion. If you want to tell us how your day was or just get some things off your chest, you will find ample opportunity to find a corner to discuss all the good things we see, or reach out to anyone who needs help. Just remember to pay attention to the Principles of Serious Discussion, and link to the source if posting news.
Re: Question about religion
Thumbs up x1 
by Goldy301 » October 21st, 2015, 10:22 pm
I think you guys should watch this... 
Thanks to FrozenFire! 5 ☆☆☆☆☆ for this!
-
Goldy301 - As Ninja As Myst
- Posts: 247
- Joined: July 1st, 2015, 9:29 pm
- Location: I live in a cave now ;P
Runolympics 2015 MVP - Thumbs Up given: 62 times
- Thumbs Up received: 33 times
Re: Question about religion
by PurpleYoshi » October 21st, 2015, 10:44 pm
....what Goldy said. I think you should watch that video.
.
this is BY's sig, pls don't say i'm a stealer, this has bee here since I first joined-
PurpleYoshi - As Ninja As Myst
- Posts: 233
- Joined: July 15th, 2015, 5:56 pm
- Location: Yoshi HELL, where every SCARY Yoshi lives!
- Thumbs Up given: 157 times
- Thumbs Up received: 13 times
Re: Question about religion
by Raz » October 22nd, 2015, 8:52 am
The video does nothing. Jesus loves you? cool, whatever helps you sleep at night.
But him nor god prove he loves us because at anytime they could get rid of disease and he hasn't. He just lets the world suffer with it's many problems.
But him nor god prove he loves us because at anytime they could get rid of disease and he hasn't. He just lets the world suffer with it's many problems.
Disclaimer: none of these messages have been edited, context can be provided if needed (thanks discord!) but absolutely does not change anything about these messages and that he's too overly defensive and cocky to make situations better
Karyete: I don't have anything to say to you, I've been deliberately trying to not offend you for years, actually, but apparently everything I say to you is wrong. You come across as so aggressive that you successfully intimidated me into not wanting to talk to you
Karyete: Seriously, what is your problem? And not only that, you fail to even acknowledge you might be in some wrong here.
Karyete: Oooh it's you? Hello. Feel free to drop this right now. You're going to make yourself look like an idiot.
Karyete: We don't want to hear your opinion at this stage.
Karyete: You're not getting any apology, especially after now.
Karyete: You can stay up on your high horse, continue to twist the truth and act like an absolute child all you want. I refuse to give respect to a man who right now is picking up a dropped argument because he simply cannot fathom the idea that he might be in the wrong.
Karyete: How pathetic
-
Raz - "quite easily the most manly man of all" --Raz
Error contacting Twitter - Posts: 4432
- Joined: July 12th, 2010, 5:48 pm
- Location: :-)
Razzian Fighter - Thumbs Up given: 40 times
- Thumbs Up received: 367 times
Re: Question about religion
Thumbs up x1
by l.m » October 22nd, 2015, 10:39 am
I think it's just a natural thing, regardless of religion or not. It's a situation that not even the morals of the Bible can get ahold of - God gave us the right to live by ourselves, and promised to stop interfering on the problems of humankind. In my opinion it still does not explain the diseases (such as TB's cancer) but if we are going to base ourselves on religion, it's more of a metaphorical thing where you must overcome your obstacles, regardless of what happens to you or what disease do you have.
Just my take on it, anyways.
Just my take on it, anyways.
- l.m
- all light absorbed
- Posts: 1685
- Joined: July 14th, 2011, 12:09 pm
- Location: in the shadows i will hide
Razzian Fighter - Thumbs Up given: 136 times
- Thumbs Up received: 148 times
Re: Question about religion
by Megar » October 22nd, 2015, 10:50 am
FrozenFire wrote:it's more of a metaphorical thing where you must overcome your obstacles
And when that obstacle is an incurable, deadly illness, what do you do then?
I mean, I agree, but I still don't get it. Not a single answer has been given to the thread's original question.
-
Megar - Follower of Razputin
Error contacting Twitter - Posts: 2482
- Joined: December 31st, 2009, 3:08 am
- Location: On the Steel Ball Run
Runolympics 2015 Winners - Thumbs Up given: 42 times
- Thumbs Up received: 147 times
Re: Question about religion
by nin10mode » October 22nd, 2015, 1:18 pm
See, you guys are assuming he is omnipotent. You aren't going to arrive at a satisfying answer with that.
If you want me to spell my opinion out, okay, but I thought the difference between omnipotence and omniscience was clear.
A God that is unable to do anything about it. An all-seeing, yet not all-powerful god. Maybe one that expended all of his energy already.
If you want me to spell my opinion out, okay, but I thought the difference between omnipotence and omniscience was clear.
A God that is unable to do anything about it. An all-seeing, yet not all-powerful god. Maybe one that expended all of his energy already.
-
nin10mode - Immune to Death
Error contacting Twitter 
Error contacting last.fm - Posts: 3087
- Joined: October 3rd, 2009, 6:11 am
- Location: Not here
Credit To Team - Thumbs Up given: 102 times
- Thumbs Up received: 221 times
Re: Question about religion
by Harmless » October 22nd, 2015, 1:21 pm
Victor Rsasz wrote:what kind of ♥♥♥♥ god allows diseases like alzheimers and cancer to exist, children to die of cancer before they can even get to high school, people to be crippled their entire life and unable to do simple things like walk and talk?
Hm.
These kinds of diseases were also a thing back then, right? How are these diseases even formed? Maybe some research into what exactly is cancer made up of and how it comes into a person's life would help.
~ Tesla Bromonovich
-
Harmless - Is it lunch time yet?
- Posts: 2793
- Joined: June 25th, 2011, 11:53 am
- Location: Mother Russia!
Runouw Votes Winner - Thumbs Up given: 271 times
- Thumbs Up received: 240 times
Re: Question about religion
Thumbs up x2
by Doram » October 22nd, 2015, 2:59 pm
I forgot to cover free will, didn't I? Yup. I forgot to cover free will. This is, in fact, the best argument I have heard from a Christian source as to why those things happen, and why they will continue to happen. (Note that this is from a Christian point of view - since that's where I studied it first - but it applies in other ways in other religions too...)
So, there's this thing. Free Will. It's serious business in Christian circles. We got it, animals don't. It's a thing. It means we have the capacity to choose. Anything. Choose Good, Choose Bad. Choose to love God and do what He says. Choose otherwise. It's all up to us. When they say that we're made in God's image, THAT is what they are talking about. He has the same power. To choose. To live our lives the way we want, and do what we want, and be who we want to be. It's a powerful thing, if you think about it.
Now, He gave us this amazing power, and He loves us UNCONDITIONALLY - let's pause for a moment over that. Unconditionally means without conditions. Without requirements. Without restrictions. Without reasons. Without end. It's how love is supposed to work, but covering that is a topic for another time - He loves us unconditionally, and respects us, and the awesomeness of this power SO MUCH, that He will not take that away from us. It's His one limitation - His one rule for Himself. He will not take control of our lives from us. He will not stop us from doing ANYTHING, because then He will have violated our Free Will.
What does that mean? That means that He cannot stop us from not loving Him, and He cannot stop us from not doing what He says. He cannot stop us from being bad people. He cannot stop us from getting hurt or hurting others. He cannot stop us from hating Him, or other people, or ourselves. He cannot stop us from ruining our planet and poisoning everyone. He cannot stop us, because if He did, that would mean the the choice was not ours, it was His, and then He will have destroyed something beautiful and infinitely valuable in His eyes.
What does that mean, when we DO decide to love Him and do what He says? That makes the faith and devotion all the more potent because it was a CHOICE. You could have chosen any of a number of other things, but out of all of that, you chose Him. That is more valuable than anything He could imagine, and worth everything else He must witness in silence.
So, in the end, it's because He loves us so much, and respects us so much, that He has consciously restrained Himself from doing this one thing: taking control of our lives, if we do not want Him to do so. And so, all of the horrors that mankind inflicts on itself is nothing that He WILL do something about, though He COULD, because it is 100% our choice to do that to ourselves, if we want, and He will NOT violate THAT.
That being said, I have said that I am not a Christian a number of times, and to me, there were just too many drawbacks to continue on with that religion. Now, that was me and my life, and my environment, which will not be the same for everyone. I have plenty of respect for Christians who have figured out how to do it right, and be good and faithful people, and follow that one golden rule he gave us - to be nice to each other. I also have a lot of respect for the actual truth in all of the Abrahamic traditions. Even if many are devoting themselves to twisting those religions into something ugly, that doesn't mean that the original is completely wrong. And, even if it misses the mark sometimes, as long as we learn from those lessons, and only ignore the stuff that contradicts that fundamentally good truth, then we are still being properly faithful.
And this next bit is where it really applies to every religion - The point of all this is to figure out how to be good people. Responsible. Compassionate. Forgiving. Helpful. To figure out how to live and work together in peace and harmony, and be the best that we can be. To find our own unique special something, and be that to the world. Because if we can figure all of that out, we will have created something beautiful indeed.
So, there's this thing. Free Will. It's serious business in Christian circles. We got it, animals don't. It's a thing. It means we have the capacity to choose. Anything. Choose Good, Choose Bad. Choose to love God and do what He says. Choose otherwise. It's all up to us. When they say that we're made in God's image, THAT is what they are talking about. He has the same power. To choose. To live our lives the way we want, and do what we want, and be who we want to be. It's a powerful thing, if you think about it.
Now, He gave us this amazing power, and He loves us UNCONDITIONALLY - let's pause for a moment over that. Unconditionally means without conditions. Without requirements. Without restrictions. Without reasons. Without end. It's how love is supposed to work, but covering that is a topic for another time - He loves us unconditionally, and respects us, and the awesomeness of this power SO MUCH, that He will not take that away from us. It's His one limitation - His one rule for Himself. He will not take control of our lives from us. He will not stop us from doing ANYTHING, because then He will have violated our Free Will.
What does that mean? That means that He cannot stop us from not loving Him, and He cannot stop us from not doing what He says. He cannot stop us from being bad people. He cannot stop us from getting hurt or hurting others. He cannot stop us from hating Him, or other people, or ourselves. He cannot stop us from ruining our planet and poisoning everyone. He cannot stop us, because if He did, that would mean the the choice was not ours, it was His, and then He will have destroyed something beautiful and infinitely valuable in His eyes.
What does that mean, when we DO decide to love Him and do what He says? That makes the faith and devotion all the more potent because it was a CHOICE. You could have chosen any of a number of other things, but out of all of that, you chose Him. That is more valuable than anything He could imagine, and worth everything else He must witness in silence.
So, in the end, it's because He loves us so much, and respects us so much, that He has consciously restrained Himself from doing this one thing: taking control of our lives, if we do not want Him to do so. And so, all of the horrors that mankind inflicts on itself is nothing that He WILL do something about, though He COULD, because it is 100% our choice to do that to ourselves, if we want, and He will NOT violate THAT.
That being said, I have said that I am not a Christian a number of times, and to me, there were just too many drawbacks to continue on with that religion. Now, that was me and my life, and my environment, which will not be the same for everyone. I have plenty of respect for Christians who have figured out how to do it right, and be good and faithful people, and follow that one golden rule he gave us - to be nice to each other. I also have a lot of respect for the actual truth in all of the Abrahamic traditions. Even if many are devoting themselves to twisting those religions into something ugly, that doesn't mean that the original is completely wrong. And, even if it misses the mark sometimes, as long as we learn from those lessons, and only ignore the stuff that contradicts that fundamentally good truth, then we are still being properly faithful.
And this next bit is where it really applies to every religion - The point of all this is to figure out how to be good people. Responsible. Compassionate. Forgiving. Helpful. To figure out how to live and work together in peace and harmony, and be the best that we can be. To find our own unique special something, and be that to the world. Because if we can figure all of that out, we will have created something beautiful indeed.
Martin Luther King Jr. wrote:Man must evolve, for all human conflict, a method which rejects revenge, aggression, and retaliation.
The foundation of such a method is love.
-
Doram - Global Moderator
- Posts: 1524
- Joined: February 22nd, 2010, 7:37 pm
- Location: Wherever I'm needed.
Cookie - Thumbs Up given: 153 times
- Thumbs Up received: 471 times
Re: Question about religion
by Charcoal » October 22nd, 2015, 3:43 pm
And if Doram's post wasn't enough, then I don't know what is.
He has taken the time to answer your questions and problems as best as he can. He has provided you with many different answers or concepts to think about.
(I'm talking about the Christian God here)
Honestly, I think God has done all he can. He's created an entire universe and put his son Jesus on Earth. He's probably worn out and can't do a whole lot at this point. At this point, he's trusting us to keep this planet beautiful.
I don't know if this was already brought up yet, but do you know about the story of Noah? Before the flooding, people were being mean and cruel to one another. They would argue or get into fights. It was looking pretty ugly, and it was taking the beauty out of this world. Nowadays, we're having similar problems, and it is making our world look rather ugly. Sickness is a problem, yes. But if we take this problem in a bad way, it'll make our world look even uglier. Let's try to keep some of the beauty left in this world to cherish, because I don't want to live on a completely ugly planet.
If we keep making this planet ugly, it'll ruin my chocolate. Buu doesn't like eating ugly chocolate.
Yeah, see? Even Buu agrees. Let's have a Halloween that we can all remember and cherish.
He has taken the time to answer your questions and problems as best as he can. He has provided you with many different answers or concepts to think about.
(I'm talking about the Christian God here)
Honestly, I think God has done all he can. He's created an entire universe and put his son Jesus on Earth. He's probably worn out and can't do a whole lot at this point. At this point, he's trusting us to keep this planet beautiful.
I don't know if this was already brought up yet, but do you know about the story of Noah? Before the flooding, people were being mean and cruel to one another. They would argue or get into fights. It was looking pretty ugly, and it was taking the beauty out of this world. Nowadays, we're having similar problems, and it is making our world look rather ugly. Sickness is a problem, yes. But if we take this problem in a bad way, it'll make our world look even uglier. Let's try to keep some of the beauty left in this world to cherish, because I don't want to live on a completely ugly planet.
If we keep making this planet ugly, it'll ruin my chocolate. Buu doesn't like eating ugly chocolate.
Yeah, see? Even Buu agrees. Let's have a Halloween that we can all remember and cherish.
-
Charcoal - Prophet of Shadowsquid
- Posts: 1171
- Joined: March 20th, 2011, 1:40 pm
- Location: Valentia
SM63 Level Designer Contest Winner - Thumbs Up given: 49 times
- Thumbs Up received: 77 times
Re: Question about religion
Thumbs up x2
by Kimonio » October 22nd, 2015, 9:34 pm
When I'm not sleepy, I might go over a few points on why I feel the video is biased in relativity to the girl's life itself. Keep in mind the one simple fact: What works for you won't work for everyone. I am an atheist, but was once a Christian, and my reason for conversion is simply that it did not apply to me nor my life, nor did it cure or medicate any ailments I had. I'm a logic-based thinker, which means I think and overthink anything I read, including religion and politics.
This is essentially why I do not accept theological theories until factual concrete evidence concludes it to be unchallenged. Jesus can't love everyone, as he died a human hundreds of years ago, and he couldn't die for our sins if he is the father of himself, essentially creating a paradox and fallacy of its own. This means Jesus had the power to blow people up, throw fireballs, etc(which he did, according to the lost gospels that are discredited as being the very first fanfictions). So why would he do this, if he's an omnipotent being with unlimited power, to the point where he could alter the flow of time and space with a yawn? This is what always leads me to the birth of the free will concept, in which an apple of a tree placed by God was eaten. Why die for sins one created? Guilt? Shame? It surely wasn't to save us, that would only further prove someone above won't admit their mistake.
But this is my take, and Doram delivered an excellent analysis of free will that I recommend reading.
In summary, religion is relative. Jesus loves you? Awesome. God loves you? Awesome. God hates homosexuals? If it helps you sleep at night, awesome, but you seriously need to think if it's because you're harboring guilt of your own fantasies.. Religion is you. It is not a guy on a podium talking about the kingdom of heaven, nor is it the camps where you get together and sing Casting Crowns. It is an organized group of faith-based individuals who all believe in a set of morals and topics, aka Christianity vs Judaism and Islam.
Bernie Sanders, for example, is Jewish by culture, Christian by philosophy, and doesn't give a damn what you believe.
All in all, ask yourself why you believe, and ask yourself why you don't believe. You might learn something as you ponder yourself.
A while back, I discussed religion with some pagan friends on Skype, and this is essentially what they said too. Their take on it was that God, like deity's live, was a child in the time of creation. When he didn't get his way, he would bust ♥♥♥♥ up or punish people. When he hit what I guess was god puberty, he got an earthling pregnant, had a kid, and then from that point up until now, he is in his teens, which they say is why he does not give a ♥♥♥♥ about us. He's like an angsty teen who sits in his room with nihilistic attitudes thinking everyone is stupid. Revelation is essentially what they said would be when he's an adult and comes to his senses.
It's a bit of a weird take, but it's a very clever one.
This is essentially why I do not accept theological theories until factual concrete evidence concludes it to be unchallenged. Jesus can't love everyone, as he died a human hundreds of years ago, and he couldn't die for our sins if he is the father of himself, essentially creating a paradox and fallacy of its own. This means Jesus had the power to blow people up, throw fireballs, etc(which he did, according to the lost gospels that are discredited as being the very first fanfictions). So why would he do this, if he's an omnipotent being with unlimited power, to the point where he could alter the flow of time and space with a yawn? This is what always leads me to the birth of the free will concept, in which an apple of a tree placed by God was eaten. Why die for sins one created? Guilt? Shame? It surely wasn't to save us, that would only further prove someone above won't admit their mistake.
But this is my take, and Doram delivered an excellent analysis of free will that I recommend reading.
In summary, religion is relative. Jesus loves you? Awesome. God loves you? Awesome. God hates homosexuals? If it helps you sleep at night, awesome, but you seriously need to think if it's because you're harboring guilt of your own fantasies.. Religion is you. It is not a guy on a podium talking about the kingdom of heaven, nor is it the camps where you get together and sing Casting Crowns. It is an organized group of faith-based individuals who all believe in a set of morals and topics, aka Christianity vs Judaism and Islam.
Bernie Sanders, for example, is Jewish by culture, Christian by philosophy, and doesn't give a damn what you believe.
All in all, ask yourself why you believe, and ask yourself why you don't believe. You might learn something as you ponder yourself.
nin10mode wrote:A God that is unable to do anything about it. An all-seeing, yet not all-powerful god. Maybe one that expended all of his energy already.
A while back, I discussed religion with some pagan friends on Skype, and this is essentially what they said too. Their take on it was that God, like deity's live, was a child in the time of creation. When he didn't get his way, he would bust ♥♥♥♥ up or punish people. When he hit what I guess was god puberty, he got an earthling pregnant, had a kid, and then from that point up until now, he is in his teens, which they say is why he does not give a ♥♥♥♥ about us. He's like an angsty teen who sits in his room with nihilistic attitudes thinking everyone is stupid. Revelation is essentially what they said would be when he's an adult and comes to his senses.
It's a bit of a weird take, but it's a very clever one.
-
Kimonio - Honorary Member
- Posts: 2114
- Joined: September 27th, 2009, 11:06 am
- Location: In the absence of nothing
- Thumbs Up given: 62 times
- Thumbs Up received: 134 times
50 posts
• Page 5 of 5 • 1, 2, 3, 4, 5