Request for Transparency

[Harmless]

As long as there's still discussion, might as well keep the poll open.

[Supershroom]

So this is done deal, am I right?

However, I'm still a bit concerned about going like

15, 17.5, 16, 17, 16, 16.5. Yup, looks good, next level.

Even if the scores are as narrow as this, it still leaves space for unfair deductions within the range of up to one point or more, which could be decisive in an LDC as narrow as e.g. the 25th with 6th place up to 3rd place being in the range of a quarter point. That's why I've said judges should also utter their main reasons for deductions.

On the other side, it's at least a good benefit to even out those massive score discrepances.

[MessengerOfDreams]

This post by MessengerOfDreams was thumbed up by:

Doram (May 14th, 2015, 5:44 pm)

[~MP3 Amplifier~]

This post by ~MP3 Amplifier~ was thumbed up by:

Doram (May 14th, 2015, 5:44 pm)

[Supershroom]

People have just got to find a good balance between the two, and okay if someone found a level very fun but had only a few flaws, and then gave that level a 6/10 in Fun, that should be picked up on, just like if they were marked down for a bug that they can't control like layering issues etc.

So yeah, I personally see no issues with the judging itself, I just think we should review them to stop people carelessly adding or taking off points without realising what the actual reason is.

You've described perfectly what I've meant. Many deducts fall under the subjectivity that a judge has a right on, but negligence is avoidable as well as being too nit-picky when giving the 6/10 as mentioned.

Also I can't understand why you would feel punished if a mistake of yours would be clarified, since you want to be fair to all contestants, right? Then again, it's a maturity task of not being too smart-alecky when picking up someone else's judgings, and we should be constructively willing on finding compromises.

[~MP3 Amplifier~]

You've described perfectly what I've meant. Many deducts fall under the subjectivity that a judge has a right on, but negligence is avoidable as well as being too nit-picky when giving the 6/10 as mentioned.

Yeah, I mean the judge has a right to score it 6/10 if that's how they genuinely feel about the level.
But if the description in their judging says "great level, with just a few flaws" followed by "6/10", all we'd ask is that they either change the score to something fairer, or that they go into more depth about why they haven't scored it higher, if they do indeed have a reason to score it 6/10.

This is just an example but yeah.

[Harmless]

Last time I checked the judges did explain themselves though. -_-

[nin10mode]

My counters to that are these:

Spoiler: show

Nin10mode
Omniquet
Fun- 7.5/10
This level was a lot of fun to trudge through at first, considering I'm a sucker for puzzles, but as the level became more mind-numbing, it started to lose its original friendly flair and come into true, raw, challenge. I love that.
Graphics- 3.5/5
The tilework is quite decorative and nicely planned, but not very much décor. Hm.
Other- 4/5
+1 no lag, good execution
FINAL SCORE: 15/20
Good 'n' challenging puzzle level, probably deserves a higher rating due to my lack of skill.

Fort Omniquet by nin10mode


Fun: 7/10 The level was a puzzle level. A way too hard puzzle level. Nothing more to say. It was fun, yes. But it was just too hard for me.


Once again I'll say as well, to counter-argue my own point: It's really easy to find patterns that aren't there if you actively look for them.

Graphics: 4.25/5 For a castle level, pretty good graphics. It didn't look like boring like most castle levels do. It looked good.

Other: 3.75/5 +0.5: No lag or loading time.
+0.1: Good ideas. Just too hard.
+0.15: Fake bridge was a really good idea.

Overall: 15/20

Nin10mode

Fun-10/10

I had a ton of fun in this level, but it wasn’t in the thrill ride I JUST OUTRUN THIRTY MOFOIN BULLET F’IN BILLS BEEEEECH kind of way. This was one of the most fun levels I’ve played, like, ever, because it’s the perfect balance of platformer, puzzle, easy, challenging, relaxing, invigorating, puzzling, clear- it’s really just the perfect balance of everything you want in a level, a very rare thing to ever accomplish in any gaming type thing. I’m proud of you, good sir.

Graphics-4.75/5
And damn me it looked great too. You always joke about the legendary 6/20 over your 7th LDC, but that was because things were too ruined. Again, balance here. I loved the eloquent tile blends here, and even if it was a bit off in some areas, it looked beautiful, to say the least, especially in the last room.

Other-4.25/5
-.5 There were avoidable instances of getting squished in the level in many areas.
+.75 Excellent, excellent music choice. *saves to library*. It actually was a good balance to the level, it kept me calm when otherwise I would not be.
+.5 I actually love that Runouw level you based the fire room off of. Good reference, and it looks just as great.
+.5 Great usage of disabled blocks for excellent mindtrickery.

Overall-19/20

If you want to do some math magic with their judging scales, here are the originals:
viewtopic.php?f=22&t=35020&hilit=omniquet&start=450#p207319
viewtopic.php?f=22&t=35020&hilit=omniquet&start=450#p207328
viewtopic.php?f=22&t=35020&hilit=omniquet&start=470#p207356

My argument here won't be "hurr I should have scored higher le"
Instead it will be why? Why does SuYo describe the enjoyment he had by saying "I love it," and give it a 7.5/10 rather than a 9 or 10? There's nothing negative listed.
And is difficulty really the only problem? What kind of audience should I be designing to? There must have been something positive to warrant a 7/10 from SMIC. What brought it up now that I vaguely recognize what's 'wrong' ?
If you look at Moy's, there are no contradictions.

That said, I'm not saying this is a trend, and I'm even being a bit hypocritical here with my light-hearted reviews (unless you really, REALLY know me), but there are certain measures that should be possible to prevent stuff like this.

[Harmless]

I did not make myself clear, sorry. I mean recent judgings have stepped up and started providing more explanations as to why something went wrong or right in a level, from their personal experience. Also from objective facts in the level, but either way, Fort Omniquet judgings were quite a while ago.

Heck, recent judgings are now WAY longer than the judges years ago, and that's because people are starting to explain themselves.

[MessengerOfDreams]

In response to Nin10mode, that really shows the problem in some LDCs- organization. The 18th LDC was a mess. Star didn't calculate the results properly, 30 different judges did 30 different levels, people didn't show up, all kinds of messed up ♥♥♥♥. So more than anything, we need to make sure every LDC is organized perfectly.